90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

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90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby MRA » Fri Nov 18, 2016 6:31 pm

I have a 1990 2.8 gas trooper with 5 speed Previous owner changed the TBI to a dinky 1bbl aisan carb. I want to put it back to TBI, first thing I dont know why they changed it in the first place or what was wrong so I will have to check everything.

I need an air cleaner with sensors can anyone tell me other than 89-91 trooper what other vehicle air cleaners will work with similar nozzle?

Next I have computer between the seats, but I dont know if it is ok or not and I have no idea how to check it any suggestions as to what vehicles might have same computer?

I don't know about fuel system if they changed pump I do know I need the two metal lines that attach to TBI then go to rubber hoses. I can locate those in junkyard

The air pump is disconnected I believe a pipe connects it to intake manifold?

I will try and get TBI from 4.3 and use 2.8 injectors and either temporarily use spacer or drill out the manifold for the larger butterflies.(have drill press and know I have to correctly alight top of manifold note base) as a side note if i take off manifold to drill it out I am considering putting in 1.6 rocker arms -thoughts?

It appears to have all other sensors except one at tbi. i do not know if they work!

also looking for aluminum alternator bracket as mine has broken and been welded twice want to have a spare other than 89-91 2.8 trooper i think 91-93 rodeo has same bracket?

one other thing i am also considering locating a 3.4 used engine and would like to know if someone can tell me where to look for serial number and decode date of manufacture I believe I want before 1/1/95

Vehicle is in Costa Rica was originally imported from USA most in junkyards there are either 4 bangers or diesel not much in way of spare parts so I have to procure them here hopefully from my local pick your part and lug them there.
I am old school before computer shade tree mechanic so this is new to me.
any help, other things to look for greatly appreciated.
1990 trooper 2.8 gas 5sp 4x4 wanting to go back to TBI from previous owner carb.
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby Ed Mc. » Sun Nov 20, 2016 6:25 pm

Howdy, let's go thru each of your questions:

Air cleaner: The MAP sensor mounts on the air cleaner but other than that, you just need an air cleaner housing that fits the TBI. Or try a cold air intake aftermarket kit. You won't be needing the heat stove or thermostatic vacuum valve for the heat stove function, since you're in a warm climate. The MAP sensor just clips to the air cleaner and instead you can just make a small bracket and mount the sensor on the firewall, or other convenient spot. One vacuum line going to the sensor plug the electrical connector. Hopefully the guy that converted to a carb didn't cut the wiring!

Engine Computer: If they didn't disturb the ECM, all you should have to do it plug it in. A rodeo 3.1 would have a compatible ECM as well, other than that you'd need one out of a Trooper or maybe an S-10 2.8.

There are some real cheap 3.1 ECM's on eBay:

http://www.ebay.com/sch/Engine-Computer ... 38&_sop=15

If you plug in the ECM and turn the key on, you should get a trouble light on the dash cluster. This would go out once all the sensors are restored & connected. As I recall there should be a fuse for the ECM circuit, so you'll have to check to see if that was removed during the conversion.

Smog Pump: I haven't messed around much with the smog pump but you could just remove it, plug any holes as necessary and use a belt from a Rodeo 3.1, as they didn't use the pump on those. If you search for posts by username "geoffinbc" you'll find a posting about the right belt to use for that. I've attached a pic of the smog pump and also the front end of a Rodeo 3.1 so you can see how the serpentine belt is routed on those.

Intake/Rockers: The 1.6:1 roller-tipped rockers are a nice upgrade, especially if you have a free-flowing exhaust system (2" or 2-1/4" works well). Comp Cams Magnum rockers are the best but if you can find a hot deal on a set of Small Block Chevy non-self-aligning rocker arms, all you have to do is toss the SBC V8's 3/8" rocker balls and use the metric rocker balls for a 2.8. Otherwise the rocker arms fit the same.

Here are some on eBay:

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R4 ... 12&_sop=15

They have a newer kit with pushrods if you need those.

If you do change the rockers, you'll need to readjust the lifter preload. The best way to do that is start at the front of one side and move your way to the back. Rotate the crankshaft each time to position the lifter being adjusted on the base circle of the cam. Then "jiggle" the pushrod up and down while tightening the rocker arm locknut. When all the slop is out of the pushrod, you're at Zero Lash. You won't need as much preload with 1.6 rockers, so only tighten the locknut another 1/2-to-3/4 turns past Zero Lash. If you get 'em too tight, the engine won't start.

Alternator Bracket: The Rodeo 3.1 might have the right bracket for your alternator, it mounts in the same place on the 3.1. Early-90's GM minivans had a throttle-body, iron-head 3.1 so if there are any of those in the scrapyard, might be a good source of parts.

Engine Swap: 3.4's were in '93-'95 Camaros and Firebirds. VIN "S". The 3.4 block looks just like a 2.8 block except there is a large "F" (for F-body) cast into both sides of the block, along with some stiffening "X" braces on the exterior. See the attached pics.

I have a collection of info for the swap, if you'd like it just P.M. me with your email address and I'll forward the info.

And let me know if you don't have the sticker on the inside of the hood for a vacuum diagram, 'cause you're gonna need one! I have it on file if needed.

Well, that's enough typing for now, at least you've got a few things to think about! Let us know how your project goes.

HTH & Welcome to the Planet!..............ed
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby MRA » Mon Nov 21, 2016 8:35 pm

20160727_080412.jpg
thanks kindly for the reply
one note the ecm was connected when I got it and the check engine light was always on (taped over with black electrical tape) I disconnected the ecm and the light went out and engine ran the same. I will pick up a spare ecm as they are reasonable.

I know I need a ecm distributor as the one I have is older carb model dist. will most any 2.8-3.1 TBI distributor work? 4.3?

If I change to 1.6 rockers do I need to use screw in studs for the rockers? I recall having do that in a 289 or 327 a few decades back when putting in a HO cam as it raised the rpm range. I doubt the rockers will change rpm much but just want to be safe. Thanks for the detailed instructions on lifters.

I think I found a copy of the right vacuum lines off the internet and that is one of my main worries as everything is disconnected including defrost vent line (took me a whole day plus to figure that out) heater core is disconnected but for rainy season I like to have defrost air at least blowing.

I am not sure why they changed to a 1bbl carb maybe just for economy or bad sensor I dont know gas is almost $6 a gallon there. Are any sensors more likely to fail than others? It might be worth my while to just take some with me in suitcase next trip down.

I had a friend lug down most all new Moog front end parts and all the squeeks are gone. I have a good honest mechanic but not sure of his TBI experience combined with my Spanish. I can't carry shock absorbers on airplane so I will ship some down with a partial container load of household stuff, thus my thought of also shipping down a used 3.4 engine at same time. Current shocks ok. Vehicle is on road vehicle but for almost one 1 mile of washboard, potholed road to my house which is a bear and slow going. Vehicle is rust free except small 1" spot near rear windows/molding. Only thing I don't like about it is the wide turning radius its a bear to drive/park on old narrow city roads. 4wd works great only used it a couple of times. I also carried a "ton" of local wood for my furniture on the roof,and inside and sometimes going through the mountains had to go to 2nd gear when loaded.

It will be after Christmas before I get back down there so it will be awhile before I can give feedback and let everyone know how its going. I'm normally in soCal

thanks again and if anyone has more suggestions or see something in the pics, feel free to respond.

attached 3 pics of 1bbl carb/engine compartment.
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1990 trooper 2.8 gas 5sp 4x4 wanting to go back to TBI from previous owner carb.
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby Ed Mc. » Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:33 pm

A one-bbl carb would sure choke-down the engine! Here's one thought, there are adapters available that bolt to the 2.8 intake and mount a 2-bbl Holley-style carb. A 400 cfm carb would flow as much as a 4.3 TBI.

http://shop.tpmperformance.com/Holley-2 ... 2bltbi.htm

Looks like the MAP is tie-wrapped over to the side, that's the sensor with the green connector.

Sounds like your ECM is "alive", it would naturally throw a trouble light since the EFI system has been butchered. Someone may have had issues with either the EFI system sensors, or maybe the relays etc that cause the fuel pump to run.

The ECM temperature sensor that's screwed into the manifold in front of the carb, is usually a troublemaker. Inexpensive and recommend replacing unless you can test the temperature calibration curve with a meter.

You'd get a TPS and the IAC on a used 4.3 TBI, the only issue with the 4.3 TBI is that the TPS connector might be different. You can change from the old flat-plug to the square connector on the newer ones. If you're in a wrecking yard and pulling the TBI, get the connector plug from that engine's wiring harness, along with enough wiring to splice into your rig's harness. You might want to pull a MAP sensor while you're in the yard, there are many rigs that use the same one. Any GM product with a TBI would have one.

On distributors, any S10 2.8 from 1986-'93 should be the same. Any '89-'91 Trooper 2.8, any '91-92 Rodeo 3.1, or '91-'94 4WD Pickup 3.1. It also looks like the iron-headed 3.1's used in early-90's minivans (Lumina APV, Pontiac TransPort, Old Silhouette) use a distributor. Don't think the 4.3 dist will work, different part numbers and the body looks a lot longer.

No issues with the rocker studs when using 1.6:1 ratio roller-tipped rockers. They work fine with the stock valve springs, and even with the performance cam and springs, I've never heard of an ironhead stud pulling out.

The roof rack is sure handy for hauling lumber! I did that when I was building my house. Carried a 20' board home one time, tied to the bumpers at both ends!

I would imagine the tighter turning radius of the 2-door models is what makes them popular all around the world, on tight trails.

Just like your Troop, my 4-door certainly doesn't turn on a dime; unlike my old '72 Datsun 1200! The little coupe wouldn't have been a good candidate for stump-jumping, though!! :twisted:

Here's a good place to look up part numbers: http://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/isuz ... v6,1177051

HTH & G'luck.......ed
'90 3.4 Troop LS;
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby Ed Mc. » Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:38 pm

Just another thought, you should check to see if the O2 sensor is still in the exhaust pipe and the sensor wire is nearby. If the sensor wire was cut, you'd have to splice another length of sensor wire in its place. Something else to grab at the wrecking yard.

And since your exhaust has been modified, they may not have even left the stock "wye" in place. You'd need to weld-in an O2 sensor bung. GM sensors are cheap, so probably a good idea to pick up one of those, too.
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'89 Troop RS (Exhaust Valve Challenged), now gone to a Good Home!
Yes, I am a Trooper-Holic!!!
Keep On Troopin' !
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby MRA » Fri Nov 25, 2016 10:30 pm

went and picked some parts 40% off discount day
got part of a distributor from 2.8 fiero, missing the rotor cap and ICM which rock auto has could not find anyother 2.8 distributors checking rock auto now it does not look like dist for trooper.

got a large chevy air cleaner with one snorkel 15" overall diam. ..snorkel could be wider but I think it will work looks like it takes a 12" by 3" filter cn you tell me size of hose that goes to front of stock trooper next to radiator is it 3" round or rectangular?
got an older 4.3 TBI from astro van it does not have holes to mount throttle bracket ( i got a bracket earlier) can it be drilled/tapped to hold bracket? looks like 3 vacuum tubes in back and one in front cant find a part number but it is pretty dirty
got 2 2.8 injectors
got several sensors map etc.
metal gas lines to tbi with filter
got a 2.8 intake manifold it was heck getting it off right rear bolt frozen with rust....almost gave up.
scored two 2.8 fiero aluminum valve covershttp://www.planetisuzoo.com/posti ... 4&t=93513#
and ta-da 5 -16" snowflakes and 2- 15" snowflakes...http://www.planetisuzoo.com/posting.php ... 4&t=93513#
by the way I have stock exhaust as far as I know. I was reading more about the two inlet one outlet cat thinking about it down the road.
smog right now is easy to pass, but they are supposedly tightening up in 2017 but haven't published regs yet-lol govt closes last two weeks of December so they better get with it.
1990 trooper 2.8 gas 5sp 4x4 wanting to go back to TBI from previous owner carb.
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby Ed Mc. » Sat Nov 26, 2016 12:20 am

The intake hose is an oval shape where it clamps to the air cleaner snorkel. Then it's round out to the point where it snaps into a flat metal piece with a hole in it. The only advantage I see to this hose is that it sucks cooler air from the grille instead of hot air from the engine compt. You could probably get some round ducting/hose that will conform to the snorkel of the air cleaner you picked up, then route/support & fasten to the metal plate. BTW the size of the hole in that plate is essentially the O.D. of the hose. The end of the stock 2.8 intake hose has a curved-part that shields the front of the tube from water intake. You might want to build some sort of baffle out of sheet metal or whatever, to give a bit of protection to your setup.

Geoff has some really good writeups of Trooper mods at his website, here's one for the 4.3 TBI swap. With details on the throttle bracket and making a new vacuum port. Check it out here:

http://members.shaw.ca/howto/28to43tb/28to43.htm

And yes, since your TBI isn't drilled for the bracket you'll have to do that. You could use the throttle cable arm to template holes to the 4.3 TBI.

Nice find on the wheels & valve covers. Geoff has a writeup for the valve covers:

http://members.shaw.ca/howto/gtvcovers/gtvcovers.htm

Those articles and much more at the main page: http://members.shaw.ca/isuzutrooper/

Re the Walker 15022 Super Converter, it's a nice unit and has an O2 sensor bung built-in. So your O2 sensor will run hotter, which means you'll get into Closed Loop faster and will have better idling. It has 2" inlets which are perfect for the Trooper V6 down pipes, but in your case you might install a 2-1/2"-to-2-1/4" adapter on the single outlet, so you don't lose all your low-end torque. 2-1/2" exhaust all-the-way-back is simply too much for a 2.8 unless it's a full-race model. 2-1/4" back of the cat will still flow very well and sound great.

Anyhow, nice score on all the parts, and with discount to boot! Now the fun begins!

Cheers.........ed
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby MRA » Sat Nov 26, 2016 5:49 am

after looking at the air cleaner picture you posted, the air cleaner I got may be too large and hit either firewall or a/c hose mine is 15 1/8"diameter but from GM and looks the same except for size.
1990 trooper 2.8 gas 5sp 4x4 wanting to go back to TBI from previous owner carb.
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby DSUZU » Sat Nov 26, 2016 8:31 am

Ed Mc. wrote:A one-bbl carb would sure choke-down the engine!

Maybe, maybe not. The Ford 300 CID 6 used a 1bbl, as did the Chevy 250 (and even 292) to name a few. It'd be interesting to see what kind of Carb and adapter he has. I do agree that a 2 BBL might give better performance and there are adapters to mount them to the intake (again, wondering what he already has).
He might be looking for performance that a 2.8 Trooper isn't going to give him - even with the TBI (although I found mine to be far better than the 2.6) Dennis
1991 LS Trooper 2.8 V6 5 speed conversion (Sold)
1989 LS Spacecab 2.6 5 speed 4x4 manual hubs, Rodeo torsion bars, extended shackles, 2" lift, K&N airfilter (drop in), dump bed conversion, burgundy interior change, warn brush bar.
Previously owned: 1987 Trooper II LS, 1989 Trooper (parts only), 1994 Trooper 3.2 Auto, 1997 Rodeo 2.6 5 speed, 1993 shortbed pickup 2.3 (project - sold) 1992 Rodeo 4x4 LS (parts car, devoured by Spacecab needs) plus some 70 plus other non Isuzu vehicles over the years.

http://forum.planetisuzoo.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=64060

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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby geoffinbc » Sat Nov 26, 2016 11:28 am

If your air cleaner ends up being too big just grab one from an S10.
1990 Trooper, 3.2L (3.1L .040 over) Pushrod V6, 5 speed manual. 33X10.50X15 BFG M/T KM2's. 3" OME Lift. Cowl Induction Intake. ARB Lockers front and rear. HD Tierods.
Off the road for an overhaul right now.

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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby MRA » Sun Nov 27, 2016 1:04 am

the 1bbl carb is an Aisan . I forget the model number but I cross referenced it and it was used mostly in small displacement jap cars-toyota usually around 1500 cc. The adapter is "micky mouse" brand flat 1/4 " aluminum with only 3 bolts holding carb to adapter I have picture posted in previous post. The car has little pickup and seems to be starved over 3,500 rpms I usually run it/shift between 2,000 and 3,000.

I am going back to original TBI for hopefully a bit more power but also to pass emissions visual.

I went back to the junkyard jungle today and picked up a s-10 4.3 air cleaner and duct-its slightly different snorkel than the trooper one, has an angle on it. Maybe later I can weld in a piece to make it taller and use two filters stacked or one 6" high filter - I also got a distributor so I think I have all the parts to put it back original will get a new O sensor just in case.

If I get a chance I will try a couple of 0-60 or 0-50 (lol) timed runs before and after the changes. Not looking for speed but more get up and go especially with loads over mountains. Maximum speed limit on rural roads is 80 kph freeways are 100kph (62mph) over 120 huge fine over 150kph jail...

I will add rockers and cat etc after I get it back stock and tested, use spacer for TBI so butterflies can open and change manifold later. I'm old school and don't like to change many things at once.

thanks so much for the help
1990 trooper 2.8 gas 5sp 4x4 wanting to go back to TBI from previous owner carb.
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby geoffinbc » Sun Nov 27, 2016 1:49 am

Holley may still sell the tapered spacer they used to have on their 502-3 throttle body. Have a loom around their website or email them. It will adapt your 1 11/16" throttle bores to the 1 3/8" manifold bores.
1990 Trooper, 3.2L (3.1L .040 over) Pushrod V6, 5 speed manual. 33X10.50X15 BFG M/T KM2's. 3" OME Lift. Cowl Induction Intake. ARB Lockers front and rear. HD Tierods.
Off the road for an overhaul right now.

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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby Ed Mc. » Sun Nov 27, 2016 2:55 am

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Yes, I am a Trooper-Holic!!!
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby geoffinbc » Sun Nov 27, 2016 2:29 pm

Ed it should say hyperlink master under your name lol.
1990 Trooper, 3.2L (3.1L .040 over) Pushrod V6, 5 speed manual. 33X10.50X15 BFG M/T KM2's. 3" OME Lift. Cowl Induction Intake. ARB Lockers front and rear. HD Tierods.
Off the road for an overhaul right now.

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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby Ed Mc. » Sun Nov 27, 2016 3:04 pm

geoffinbc wrote:Ed it should say hyperlink master under your name lol.


Bookmarks and a good search engine are your friends!! :twisted:

I use Duckduckgo 'cause it doesn't track you as does the Evil Google.
'90 3.4 Troop LS;
'89 Troop RS (Exhaust Valve Challenged), now gone to a Good Home!
Yes, I am a Trooper-Holic!!!
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby MRA » Fri Dec 02, 2016 5:08 pm

thanks very much for all the help you guys are lifesavers. I have started cleaning up the junkyard parts and I am trying to see what else I need part wise and information wise.

first the intake manifold I got has some corrosion near gasket surface and kinda like round indentations that don't go anywhere-is this usual?(right side of pic) I plan on having a friend weld some material near the narrowest parts of the gasket area and grind it down even-does that seem like a good idea? or fill in the depressions completely? also one of the round welds(?) holding tray on is bad -(far side of pic)-ideas? pic attached

the TBI I got seems to have correct TPS connector it is 3 wire pointing upwards
there are 3 vacuum lines on one side and the large one was completely blocked, got carb sparay through it and q tips, might try round pistol bore brass brush? I have looked at several you tube rebuild your tbi videos as TBI is completely new to me. I will get a rebuild kit, and taller spacer for injectors (or stack 2 together?) will check injectors with 9volt battery -(momentarily just touching terminals ). TBI throttle plates have very small movement side to side when open, none up and down...

I had to cut the 4 wires coming from injectors and since I dont have my Trooper here, I dont know if they have a connector on the engine..I did see someone's tbi where they added a 4 pin weather proof connector on both tbi and vehicle-that looks like an idea so I could disconnect it easily.

I took the TBI off I think 1987 Astro van 4.3 it had a bracket with three sensors attached-one is MAP (so now i have a spare) other 2 not sure of see 2nd pic. I don't know where the ICM ignition control module is-I looked at pics on Rock Auto but have no idea where it is on trooper. also it has a vacuum line connector coming out of tbi between gasoline connectord where might this go on vehicle? intake manifold has t vacuum fitting ? also came with temp sensor- I might just buy a new sensor as they may be hard to get down there. any thoughts as to what else I might take down new? ah yes I won't be going back till probably february so i have time to get things together.

my distributor has two connectors one 4 wire one 2 wire the 2 wire obviously goes to the coil the 4 wire I dont know but would guess vehicle wiring harness-somewhere. help!

thanks again I am very grateful.
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby geoffinbc » Sun Dec 04, 2016 2:31 pm

That manifold will definatly need some weld or just exchange it for another. That is the worst I have ever seen. Sand blast the intake so you know what you have to work with. I doubt you will be able to TIG it. The castings are quite dirty you may have to MIG it. I have tried TIG welding on a few and they just spit and pop the whole time. Lay down and MIG layer then you can TIG over that if you want. The heat shield is held on with rivets. You can pry them out and tap the holes for bolts. When I do this I always safety wire the bolts in place.
1990 Trooper, 3.2L (3.1L .040 over) Pushrod V6, 5 speed manual. 33X10.50X15 BFG M/T KM2's. 3" OME Lift. Cowl Induction Intake. ARB Lockers front and rear. HD Tierods.
Off the road for an overhaul right now.

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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby MRA » Sun Dec 04, 2016 7:22 pm

It cost me $25 at pick n pull 40% discount sale and $6 core so I might just give it back and get another one ( i didnt buy guarantee so no exchange)
without discount $41 plus $6 core for another one and my labor to take it off. (they might have an xmas 40% sale in Dec) I didn't see how bad it was till i scraped off the corrosion, the depressions were flat. ( i got what i paid for -cheap near worthless LOL ) I do have a friend who was a pro welder for 10 years, and I'll have him look at it. I am a dummy when it comes to welding. I live near Mexico and planned on taking it to a machine shop there to get it sand or soda blasted and drill out the bores as it is relatively inexpensive there.
are those depressions supposed to be there or are they supposed to be flat? I saw a pic of one that had no depressions on planet isuzu several years back.

thanks much I appreciate everyone's help immensly.
1990 trooper 2.8 gas 5sp 4x4 wanting to go back to TBI from previous owner carb.
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby geoffinbc » Tue Dec 06, 2016 1:24 pm

There are 2 small depressions. Those areas just block the water ports in the head forcing water through the front of the intake to the thermostat.
1990 Trooper, 3.2L (3.1L .040 over) Pushrod V6, 5 speed manual. 33X10.50X15 BFG M/T KM2's. 3" OME Lift. Cowl Induction Intake. ARB Lockers front and rear. HD Tierods.
Off the road for an overhaul right now.

Big Bore Intake Kits & Greasable Shackles Here
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Re: 90 trooper 2.8 gas parts interchange info needed please

Postby MRA » Tue May 02, 2017 4:33 pm

I got another manifold much better shape and tbi jets s10 alt bracket etc off an s10. I got all the parts down to Costa Rica in my bags. 2 50 pounders had hardware for a murphy bed also (spring style cant send shocks -compressed gas on planes now) Did not change out TBI yet, worked on other stuff will post in other thread. going back in a couple of months and will tackle the TBI!
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1990 trooper 2.8 gas 5sp 4x4 wanting to go back to TBI from previous owner carb.
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