John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby itsmehb » Sun Mar 12, 2017 2:19 pm

Boy, what we don't run into with our cars. You can sit back and be very proud with what you've accomplished so far. It takes a lot of talent (southern engineering) to finish such a project.
1990 Amigo, 2.3 5 speed (sold)
1991 Pick up (long gone)
2000 Amigo, 2.2 5 speed(sold)
1985 Trooper 1.9 4 speed (sent back to KS)
1989 Trooper RS 2.6 5 spd. Red

We get too soon old and too late smart!
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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby wmorrisiii » Tue Mar 14, 2017 8:44 pm

Amazing attention to detail and to function, really nice build and fun to read (your pictures were helpful). Congratulations on getting 'er done!
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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby Johnthegoon » Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:29 am

Well, not DONE done.. there's still a nice long punch-list of stuff to fix before I even get started on bumpers and paint. While I had the wheels off and the hubs apart anyway, I decided to also address the alignment. I bought a set of those eccentric ball-joint collars (1.25 deg) and I installed them at such an angle that I sort of split the adjustment between caster and camber. My main goal was to fix the camber so that I don't need to go back and use those spindle shims. But, there was enough adjustment that I could also give myself some caster improvement as well. It won't be much, but I've also got the U-bolts back off to install a 2 degree shim there too. I'm hoping that 2 (shim) + 0.7 (collar) + 2.3 (starting point) = pretty driveable. It actually wasn't even terrible at the 2.3 starting point, but I've got a day's worth of "put back together" to do before I can drive it and see. I've also got a steering stabilizer waiting to go on.

Another reason I want the shims is because my front pinion is actually pointed ABOVE the front output of the transfer case. If I can rock it down a few degrees to point right at it, that will optimize the double-cardan driveshaft.

IMG_4871.JPG
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~~John
Current zu: 2000 Trooper, SAS with V8 conversion, dual battery, homemade roof rack, homemade rear storage, DC-AC inverter, Custom hail damage - Bought in Oct 2010 w/ 151k.
Build threads: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67783 - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=82355

Previous zu: 1992 Rodeo XS, 4x4 TBI V6 5-spd, Shackle lift and T-bar crank, on-board air. Bought Jan 2003 w/ 161k - given to a family @ church, winter 2006
2001 Chevy Silverado 2500HD
2013 Audi S5
2013 Honda Odyssey
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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby Johnthegoon » Sun Apr 30, 2017 9:39 am

Been a while since my last update, have been doing lots of little things to the truck, but not much major to report..

I finally tracked down my speedometer issue.. I had it wired in parallel with my VSS to ECU, but turns out the ECU doesn't ground that pin well enough for the gauge to read. I cut all the connection to the ECU and just hard-grounded it and everything works perfectly now. I called Howell and confirmed that my setup doesn't actually need a VSS anyway (They included it because when I ordered the kit, I wasn't sure if I was going to use a 4LxxE transmission or a non-electronic one).

I also re-rigged the throttle arm with a new stud so I can get WOT from the accelerator now - this thing's got great power, and I'm sure there's more in there that I haven't found yet. I took it to a transmission shop because I wasn't happy with the shifting and I couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong. They adjusted/set the TV cable, but my shift points are a little low. The 700 uses a weighted governor, and you change shift points by experimenting with different weights and springs on it. I bought a kit but haven't got into it yet.
~~John
Current zu: 2000 Trooper, SAS with V8 conversion, dual battery, homemade roof rack, homemade rear storage, DC-AC inverter, Custom hail damage - Bought in Oct 2010 w/ 151k.
Build threads: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67783 - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=82355

Previous zu: 1992 Rodeo XS, 4x4 TBI V6 5-spd, Shackle lift and T-bar crank, on-board air. Bought Jan 2003 w/ 161k - given to a family @ church, winter 2006
2001 Chevy Silverado 2500HD
2013 Audi S5
2013 Honda Odyssey
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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby Johnthegoon » Sun Apr 30, 2017 9:57 am

Cooling is the next issue to tackle. I have a 195* thermostat in it, and at idle and slow speeds, it's rock-steady there but it climbs to about 210-215* at highway speeds. I bought a fan shroud kit from Summit that was allegedly designed to work with my radiator (also from Summit). My fan isn't quite centered, and by the time I had it modified to fit well, it probably would have been easier to just build one from scratch. It helps some; it takes longer to get hot and runs about 5* cooler once it finally settles into a maximum.

IMG_5039.JPG

IMG_5047.JPG

I noticed my upper flex hose expands a scary amount when it's pressurized, and started rubbing on the alternator (it cleared when it was cold). The lower hose was worse, it stretched as it expanded and partially kinked itself when it got hot.. Obviously that wouldn't work.. I took it back to the same shop that did my exhaust, he had tooling for 1.5" tubing so I had him bend me a hard line that won't flex or kink.

IMG_5052.JPG

The lower radiator hose was a different story. He couldn't radius the bends tight enough to make it work, so I needed plan B. I had some old hoses that weren't in good shape and weren't the right size, etc.. I cut them into individual bends and played around with piecing them together. Eventually I figured out a way to get there with just two bends and a coupler.

IMG_5053.JPG

It's still running a little hotter than the T-stat, but 205-210* is acceptable. I haven't run it for a long time in the dead of summer, and I don't have the AC or the bumper installed yet, so it's marginal -- we'll see. My next step will be to hard-mount the fan without the clutch. I know I'll sacrifice power, but I'd rather have reliability, and I've got plenty of power. I keep coming back to electric fans, but the physics don't make sense in my mind. People say the mechanical fan can rob up to 5-10hp.. there's no way an electric fan can match that. 5hp is about 3700 watts, which is 300 amps at 12v.. Even allowing for differences in design and efficiency, I just don't see it.

I'm also going to slap on the biggest transmission cooler that Hayden makes - it's their motorhome model. Maybe it'll help some by not putting as much heat into the water. We'll see. The cloud on the horizon is that I don't have enough radiator for my engine - but I'm trying everything to make it work because it's a major redesign and fab project to put a bigger one in.
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~~John
Current zu: 2000 Trooper, SAS with V8 conversion, dual battery, homemade roof rack, homemade rear storage, DC-AC inverter, Custom hail damage - Bought in Oct 2010 w/ 151k.
Build threads: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67783 - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=82355

Previous zu: 1992 Rodeo XS, 4x4 TBI V6 5-spd, Shackle lift and T-bar crank, on-board air. Bought Jan 2003 w/ 161k - given to a family @ church, winter 2006
2001 Chevy Silverado 2500HD
2013 Audi S5
2013 Honda Odyssey
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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby Johnthegoon » Sun Apr 30, 2017 10:16 am

I also finally got around to brushing the rust off and painting my air cleaner.

IMG_5046.JPG

Once I get the transmission shifting where I want it, I'm going to take it to Total Engine Service, a shop with a good regional reputation that just happens to be local and have them dyno tune it. They've got a lot of experience with Howell EFI; two local friends have both seen near 60-80hp gains over their "get it running" guess-work settings at home, and it's worth it even if I can get that surging idle figured out.

After it's all running like butter, I'll dork around with getting the cruise control hooked up and figured out. I'm not adding that confusion to the mix until it's perfect.
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~~John
Current zu: 2000 Trooper, SAS with V8 conversion, dual battery, homemade roof rack, homemade rear storage, DC-AC inverter, Custom hail damage - Bought in Oct 2010 w/ 151k.
Build threads: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67783 - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=82355

Previous zu: 1992 Rodeo XS, 4x4 TBI V6 5-spd, Shackle lift and T-bar crank, on-board air. Bought Jan 2003 w/ 161k - given to a family @ church, winter 2006
2001 Chevy Silverado 2500HD
2013 Audi S5
2013 Honda Odyssey
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Alignment

Postby Johnthegoon » Sun Apr 30, 2017 10:34 am

I've been fighting the alignment since the first day I got it running.. Some of this is re-hash; At first, everything was out and it was scary. I took it to my favorite local tire shop, that also has alignment services. The guys were super-cool and geeked out over what I had done to it. They set the toe which is all they could do, and gave me a readout on the rest of it. Caster was a little weak but at least it was positive. Camber was positive too, which was no doubt contributing to my rollover tendency in every turn. I put in those eccentric ball-joint sleeves to give myself some more camber and caster, and put in 2 degree shims (and new u-bolt plates) but that naturally screwed up the toe, and a skyjacker steering stabilizer, so I took it back to see where I was.

IMG_4916.JPG

There was a different dude running the rack that day, and he tweaked the toe back and gave me a printout that looked like it should drive really well, but it just didn't.... I chalked it up to big tires, soft springs, over-boosted steering and no sway bar... but the more I looked at it, the more it visibly LOOKED toed out and I couldn't make myself like it. Long story short (well..) I took it to a specialized alignment shop that does everything from civics to school buses.. The ancient guy who runs the shop needed a boost to even get in the trooper to pull it on the rack... turns out the front was toed out more than a full inch, and the camber and caster were in perfect spec. It still needs a sway bar, but it drives like a cadillac with 35" tires.

Lesson learned that day: go with the ancient dudes who have made it their life's work.
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~~John
Current zu: 2000 Trooper, SAS with V8 conversion, dual battery, homemade roof rack, homemade rear storage, DC-AC inverter, Custom hail damage - Bought in Oct 2010 w/ 151k.
Build threads: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67783 - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=82355

Previous zu: 1992 Rodeo XS, 4x4 TBI V6 5-spd, Shackle lift and T-bar crank, on-board air. Bought Jan 2003 w/ 161k - given to a family @ church, winter 2006
2001 Chevy Silverado 2500HD
2013 Audi S5
2013 Honda Odyssey
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4wd?

Postby Johnthegoon » Sun Apr 30, 2017 10:57 am

So now I've got something really exclusive, maybe 1 of a kind.. a V8 2nd-gen trooper on 35's with a solid front axle and 2-wheel-drive...

I swapped the front yoke on the transfer case for a double-cardan CV yoke, and took measurements up the local driveline place, and they built me a front driveshaft. Holding it in place, I may have to clearance the transmission pan just a bit, but I'm hopeful.. this transmission/t-case/driveshaft combination was a factory option, so it'll probably work even if it's close.

I gave up on adapting the isuzu shifter to work with the NP205, making a working linkage to a shifter that already fits the body and interior.. it'll be much easier the other way around, using a GM factory shifter and linkage that already works, and making it fit the body and interior. I need to fabricate a bracket to bolt the pivot to, and I'm having a friend turn me some brass bushings to make the pivot nice and smooth. The factory GM shifter had bends in it made it not work with the hole in the floor, and it's not quite long enough. A MAPP torch, bench vise and cheater pipe removed the bends.

IMG_5145.JPG

IMG_5147.JPG


I have no doubt I'll need to put a few new bends in it to make it work well, and since it's not long enough, I can weld the top of the isuzu shifter on to it and keep a factory-ish look from inside.
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Last edited by Johnthegoon on Sat May 27, 2017 10:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
~~John
Current zu: 2000 Trooper, SAS with V8 conversion, dual battery, homemade roof rack, homemade rear storage, DC-AC inverter, Custom hail damage - Bought in Oct 2010 w/ 151k.
Build threads: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67783 - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=82355

Previous zu: 1992 Rodeo XS, 4x4 TBI V6 5-spd, Shackle lift and T-bar crank, on-board air. Bought Jan 2003 w/ 161k - given to a family @ church, winter 2006
2001 Chevy Silverado 2500HD
2013 Audi S5
2013 Honda Odyssey
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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby paulevans76 » Sun Apr 30, 2017 8:35 pm

Lookin' good. Solid progress.
91 SAS Trooper - Neverending tinkering
Semi-hopped-up 3.4 + MUA5 + 3.07:1 low
Waggy D44 Front - 5.38's + RCV's + OX
Rodeo D44 Rear - 5.38's + Detroit
35" General Grabber X3's on Interco Birddogs
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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby bradzuzu » Mon May 01, 2017 10:55 am

Glad to hear the alignments dialed in now .. I wonder how the one guy set it with toe out that far ???

I'm looking forward to more pics !!

Great progress buddy !!
91 amigo sas toy front leaf- traded off :(
2000 amigo sas d44 wagonear 4 link
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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby Johnthegoon » Wed May 10, 2017 12:48 pm

bradzuzu wrote:Glad to hear the alignments dialed in now .. I wonder how the one guy set it with toe out that far ???



I have no idea.. I've never been up close to an alignment machine - it is possible to not have it set tight against the wheel rims?
~~John
Current zu: 2000 Trooper, SAS with V8 conversion, dual battery, homemade roof rack, homemade rear storage, DC-AC inverter, Custom hail damage - Bought in Oct 2010 w/ 151k.
Build threads: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67783 - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=82355

Previous zu: 1992 Rodeo XS, 4x4 TBI V6 5-spd, Shackle lift and T-bar crank, on-board air. Bought Jan 2003 w/ 161k - given to a family @ church, winter 2006
2001 Chevy Silverado 2500HD
2013 Audi S5
2013 Honda Odyssey
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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby bradzuzu » Tue May 16, 2017 11:02 pm

Possibly or he just didn't spec it right , long ago when I had the amigo checked I told them to look up a wagoneer and see what it called for since that's what the axles out of...
91 amigo sas toy front leaf- traded off :(
2000 amigo sas d44 wagonear 4 link
custom built buggy ffor the dirty stuff

My build up page
Four link pics
Intake R&R - port and polish

Sometimes trying is all you can do, but when you succeed , that's something to be proud of...
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Overhead switch panel do-over

Postby Johnthegoon » Wed May 24, 2017 4:24 pm

When I first put in my overhead switch panel, I messed up drilling the first two holes, so I just half-a$$ed the rest of it with the intention of fixing it later... I only had two functional switches in it and 3 extras for future use, but it looked like a toddler had done it.

IMG_5225.JPG

As part of "having it all apart anyway" I decided to rebuild this to look better and be more functional. The fan shroud kit came with a nice straight piece of sheet aluminum with square corners that was the perfect size. I counted up the switches I needed along with future-proofing a few extras and came up with 10, then took the time to properly lay out the drill holes and actually do them on the press.

IMG_5220.JPG

I got some toggle switches with pilot lights in the stalk. Most of the switches have a common positive because they control relays, and the pilot lights have their own ground, so I just wired those two sides of the switches in parallel. Then I re-used the hacked up VGA cable that I had already run through the A-pillar to carry those signals back down, and then extended all the wires to run under the passenger carpet to the spot under the seat where the TOD computer used to live.

IMG_5224.JPG

IMG_5412.JPG

IMG_5411.JPG
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~~John
Current zu: 2000 Trooper, SAS with V8 conversion, dual battery, homemade roof rack, homemade rear storage, DC-AC inverter, Custom hail damage - Bought in Oct 2010 w/ 151k.
Build threads: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67783 - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=82355

Previous zu: 1992 Rodeo XS, 4x4 TBI V6 5-spd, Shackle lift and T-bar crank, on-board air. Bought Jan 2003 w/ 161k - given to a family @ church, winter 2006
2001 Chevy Silverado 2500HD
2013 Audi S5
2013 Honda Odyssey
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Relay panel

Postby Johnthegoon » Wed May 24, 2017 4:45 pm

I also decided to centralize and relay-control as much as I could, instead of having random parts scattered around the truck from previous earlier evolutions. I pulled together the two loops I made in the neutral safety circuit and the tap I made in the backup light circuit. The relays all snap together, and with as many as I have, they're pretty stable without being screwed down. On top of that, I screwed my ham-radio APRS tracker to a little board.

IMG_5414.JPG

The antenna lead runs along the door-sill and out the back door to a mag-mount on the roof (I'll probably do something better once I figure out my roof rack), and the GPS receiver runs up the B-pillar and is foam-taped to the ceiling above the passenger (it's smaller and about the same weight as your average matchbox). It all tucks nicely under the little flap of carpet that originally covered the TOD unit, and the seat fits over it with plenty of room.

IMG_5415.JPG

I painted the switch panel and then installed the switches.. I was anal and made sure the hex-rings were all lined up on the switches, and then pop-riveted it in place just like before. I "borrowed" the label maker from work and made some stickers for it. I think it looks a lot better and is much more functional.

FullSizeRender.jpg

IMG_5450.JPG

I've got a switch to power on the AC inverter in the back, switches for front light bar and side light bars when they're installed. The rear switch controls the backup lights and will also control rear utility lights when they're installed. Both sets of lights will come on in reverse OR when I flip the switch. NSSK is the starter kill switch. Unless this switch is ON, the starter relay won't get power no matter how you hotwire it - you'd have to physically jump the starter solenoid to get it to engage. This switch doesn't have its pilot light connected because I don't want to draw attention to it... when the truck is parked and disabled, all the switches face the same direction so it blends in.. it won't start unless it's in the up position.
The bottom row has an override switch for the accessory power so I can listen to the radio, etc without the keys. The APRS tracker is connected to the same circuit - it gets power any time the stereo system has power. The APRSK switch de-energizes and disables the tracker if I don't want it on for some reason. The last switch NSSO is the neutral safety override - when it's on, I can start the truck in whatever gear I want, and not just park. I honestly don't know how useful that will be in an auto-trans truck, but it was so easy to add that feature since I was jacking with the neutral safety circuit anyway, I figured why not. The last two switches are future-proofing, I may not ever use them..
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~~John
Current zu: 2000 Trooper, SAS with V8 conversion, dual battery, homemade roof rack, homemade rear storage, DC-AC inverter, Custom hail damage - Bought in Oct 2010 w/ 151k.
Build threads: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67783 - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=82355

Previous zu: 1992 Rodeo XS, 4x4 TBI V6 5-spd, Shackle lift and T-bar crank, on-board air. Bought Jan 2003 w/ 161k - given to a family @ church, winter 2006
2001 Chevy Silverado 2500HD
2013 Audi S5
2013 Honda Odyssey
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Transfer case shifter

Postby Johnthegoon » Sat May 27, 2017 9:58 pm

I decided to make an effort on getting the shifter and linkage for the transfer case figured out. The bushings I was waiting for never got made, so I went to plan B, which wound up being easier than my plan A was going to be.

The challenge is to solidly mount the lever on a pivot that can then still turn freely. I tore down the shifter bracket that I had originally made when I was trying to use the isuzu shifter. I figured I'd have to make a spacer that I could solidly bolt to the bracket that the shifter could then pivot on.

The first thing I did was take a piece of small tubing with a perfect ID for a 1/2" bolt and turn it down to fit inside the shifter bore. I don't have a lathe, so I just rolled it back and forth against my flap disc until it was just the right size to pivot without rattling.

IMG_5476.JPG

Then I used a 1/2" bolt, welded to the back of the bracket, to make a mounting stud.

IMG_5512.JPG

The shifter slides over the spacer on the bolt and the spacer tightens down on the bolt with a big fender washer and a nut.

IMG_5513.JPG

With everything bolted together, the factory configuration is duplicated perfectly and the chevrolet linkage rod slips right in. I smeared some grease on the spacer and it turns smoothly without binding or rattling.

IMG_5514.JPG

IMG_5515.JPG
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~~John
Current zu: 2000 Trooper, SAS with V8 conversion, dual battery, homemade roof rack, homemade rear storage, DC-AC inverter, Custom hail damage - Bought in Oct 2010 w/ 151k.
Build threads: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67783 - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=82355

Previous zu: 1992 Rodeo XS, 4x4 TBI V6 5-spd, Shackle lift and T-bar crank, on-board air. Bought Jan 2003 w/ 161k - given to a family @ church, winter 2006
2001 Chevy Silverado 2500HD
2013 Audi S5
2013 Honda Odyssey
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Johnthegoon
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transfer case shifter

Postby Johnthegoon » Sat May 27, 2017 10:05 pm

I marked and cut the chevy shifter lever at about the right height, then welded the top half of the isuzu shifter on the end, so it would look stock on the inside.

IMG_5516.JPG

IMG_5517.JPG

I had to heat and bend the shift lever to make it line up nicely with the console and provide enough range of back and forth movement, but it looks good and shifts well. Brushed and painted, I'll install it for real tomorrow, and then put in the front drive shaft and it'll finally be 4wd.
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~~John
Current zu: 2000 Trooper, SAS with V8 conversion, dual battery, homemade roof rack, homemade rear storage, DC-AC inverter, Custom hail damage - Bought in Oct 2010 w/ 151k.
Build threads: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67783 - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=82355

Previous zu: 1992 Rodeo XS, 4x4 TBI V6 5-spd, Shackle lift and T-bar crank, on-board air. Bought Jan 2003 w/ 161k - given to a family @ church, winter 2006
2001 Chevy Silverado 2500HD
2013 Audi S5
2013 Honda Odyssey
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Johnthegoon
Has a Trail Truck
 
Posts: 309
Joined: Tue Oct 26, 2010 2:17 pm
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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby itsmehb » Sun May 28, 2017 7:16 am

what you've accomplished so far is amazing. We have had some builds that take loads of mechanical talent. One that stands out was the Mercedes diesel engine stuffed into the 2nd gen. Amigo, or Rodeo sport, and then painted bright red. Yours ranks right up there at the top.
1990 Amigo, 2.3 5 speed (sold)
1991 Pick up (long gone)
2000 Amigo, 2.2 5 speed(sold)
1985 Trooper 1.9 4 speed (sent back to KS)
1989 Trooper RS 2.6 5 spd. Red

We get too soon old and too late smart!
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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby bradzuzu » Mon May 29, 2017 12:40 pm

That looks perfect John !! How soon till you get a front shaft built and put in ?
91 amigo sas toy front leaf- traded off :(
2000 amigo sas d44 wagonear 4 link
custom built buggy ffor the dirty stuff

My build up page
Four link pics
Intake R&R - port and polish

Sometimes trying is all you can do, but when you succeed , that's something to be proud of...
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Re: John's 2000 Trooper V8 SAS

Postby Johnthegoon » Mon May 29, 2017 4:17 pm

Thanks for the kind words!! It's encouraging to make progress but it's also a big lift to get compliments from people around here who I really look up to.

The driveshaft has been built for a month or two already, just waiting for me to get around to figuring out the linkage... installing it would have blocked my access to that area. I'm working until Thursday, but I expect to put it all together and test it out then. Then I need to flex it out and see if/where body trimming needs to happen. The next fab project is getting a front sway-bar installed.. I have the pieces and a mental design, I've just gotta get time to sit down and do it. It's pretty tippy now.. those lift springs are softer than I expected.
~~John
Current zu: 2000 Trooper, SAS with V8 conversion, dual battery, homemade roof rack, homemade rear storage, DC-AC inverter, Custom hail damage - Bought in Oct 2010 w/ 151k.
Build threads: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67783 - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=82355

Previous zu: 1992 Rodeo XS, 4x4 TBI V6 5-spd, Shackle lift and T-bar crank, on-board air. Bought Jan 2003 w/ 161k - given to a family @ church, winter 2006
2001 Chevy Silverado 2500HD
2013 Audi S5
2013 Honda Odyssey
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Johnthegoon
Has a Trail Truck
 
Posts: 309
Joined: Tue Oct 26, 2010 2:17 pm
Location: Lubbock, TX
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