2.6 cam specs table!

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Postby psguardian » Tue Jan 11, 2011 11:29 am

BUMP

What's the word squatch? Ever degree those cams for side by side proof? I just managed to save a calmini cam from the scrap pile so I'll be joining you in the world of rare cams.

Also if you need a pointer for the degree wheel wrap a chunk of coat hanger or stiff copper wire around any random bolt and bend it into position. 0* the crank & just spin the degree wheel until 0* lines up with your home made pointer.

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Postby ImpulseRocket89 » Wed Jan 12, 2011 5:50 am

Hey guys, I just wanted to put this out there for all of you 4Z engined trucks. There is another option for camshafts that us strange Impulse guys over on Isuzone use. They are done by a member named Suprf1y who has been doing cam regrinds for Suzuki's for many many years and the Isuzu crowd for the last 5 or so. He is up in Canada, but his service is top notch and he sells a quality product.

This is what he offers for us, but could most likely do whatever grind you wanted.

FYI, this is what I recommend for this application

Lift in inches, duration at .050"

440/218 torquer/street power, mildly rough idle
465/224 street/strip type grind, rougher idle
480/232 street/strip/excellent midrange-needs gearing rough idle
500/260 insane top end race only

Stock is 390/200


The price last i knew it was about $150 + any shipping

It is easiest to get a hold of him by E-mail.
[email protected]
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Postby psguardian » Wed Jan 12, 2011 6:04 am

Interesting, I would like to see those cam specs in full. Are those for naturally asperated or turbo'd 4Zxx rigs?

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Postby ImpulseRocket89 » Wed Jan 12, 2011 3:40 pm

If you want real detailed information on the cams it would probably be best to e-mail him.

As per your question, most of the cars that have these cam profiles are turbocharged, but they have also proven to work well in a couple of naturally aspirated applications. In any case its better than the stock cam profile by about a million miles.
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Postby psguardian » Wed Jan 12, 2011 4:29 pm

Email away! Hopefully he has the profile specs still, is he currently producing or was this something he did years ago?

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Postby ImpulseRocket89 » Thu Jan 13, 2011 2:46 am

He still does it the last I knew. All you have to do is get in touch with him and send him a cam to do the work to.

The very first cam profile is essentially what the most powerful Impulse over on Isuzone is running (along with some decent head work and larger valves). It is Soren's car and he made [email protected] and 414lb-ft @4500rpm using a GT30R turbo at 20psi.
EDIT: I found his dyno plot. Image

The real story with the dyno plot is the power curve. It made over 400lb-ft from 3900-5200rpm and 300lb-ft from 3500 all the way to 6500. I will grant you the GT30R is more on the top end of the performance spectrum, but I wanted to use it as a comparison to another dyno done by another member a while ago using a very similarly sized turbocharger and his 2.6.

A box standard 4ZE1 with a T3/60-1 turbocharger at 18psi that made 254whp and 385lb-ft all before 5400rpm. The reason it ended so soon was the power fell WAY off past 5200 due to the cam profile and stock head capabilities. However, that power curve was enough to make a small block blush lol.

Moral of the story. The head and cam are the two biggest restrictions to making any kind of power on these engines.
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Postby MarkB.NV » Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:18 am

Interesting ... I have a spare 4ZE1 cam.

Anybody have a map for the Calmini profile?
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Postby psguardian » Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:21 am

Looks like we may be talking about two diff base CAMs here... I just got a reply from him, the profiles he gave me are much lower lift then quoted above (0.340"-0.375" with duration @ 0.050" lift from 210*-226*). Will go back n forth with him a few times & let y'all know what comes of it.

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Re: 2.6 cam specs table!

Postby psguardian » Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:48 pm

squatch wrote:...
Stock Isuzu 2.6 cam
Duration at .050 170 degrees
Per Jlemond>
I assume nominal duration start of lobe lift to end of close at 248-254 max degrees.
Lift (I assume at lobe) .231 x1.65 rocker=.38115 (.381) at valve.
Lift per JLemond 10MM=0.3937 (.394) (I assume at valve)
Lobe centers 111 degrees
Lash int= .008 ex= .008

Calmini 2.3-2.6 cam
Duration at .050 175 degrees
Start of lobe lift to end of close ?
Lift (I assume at lobe) .241 x1.65 rocker=.39768 (.398) at valve.
Lobe centers 108 degrees
Lash int=? ex=?...


Can someone explain to me the lobe centers measurement? Having a low intelligence day, can't seem to find this one. Does this mean that the Calmini CAM is hard wired for a 3* advance in timing (valve events) or that the lobe centers are actually closer together? :scratch:

~psguardian

P.S. I'm still emailing with the guy about more alternatives, we started off talking about two diff motors. We are on the same page now, looks like he just changes lobe characteristics (like delta does) by changing lift &/or duration to your order. No cutting from blanks to adjust lobe centers.
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Postby psguardian » Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:20 pm

Latest on the custom CAM front:

I gave him the measurements from the O.P. he thinks the stock duration should measure a bit longer @ 0.050" lift then 170, other then that he had this to say

It's all about power band.
Tell me where you're going to rev, and I'll give you the duration to do it, and as much lift as I can for the given profile.


So who wants what guys?

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Postby ajm291 » Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:42 am

I'd be interested in something like the Calmini cam. I'm not sure if this is possible though. I thought that I read somewhere that this cam is not a regrind which makes me think that it isn't possible to take a stock cam and regrind it to meet the Calmini specs. Maybe someone more knowledgeable on this subject can confirm this?


I don't know much about camshafts, but I do know that I would like something that wakes the engine up in the mid to high RPM range. I need to make up my mind on a camshaft because I've been waiting to send my ECM to Jet performance so that they can tune it for the cam. I was going to go the delta 270 route, but now that there may be another option, I'm going to wait.

Let me know what you hear.
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Postby Apeiron » Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:48 am

You can regrind a stock cam to just about any specs you like. The base circle and nose will just be shorter.
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Postby ajm291 » Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:10 pm

Below is what I was referring to. This info is from another post on a different isuzu forum:

2.6/2.3's use the same cam, headers too. The Delta reground cams are about $120, the 260 is for low end torque, the 270 produces power about 700 rpms higher. You need to install swivel foot valve adjusters from a Porsche 911 or VW valve stem caps to keep the contact patch more correct. EMPI is a good brand. The Calmini cam is a new billet, use the stock valve adjusters, it is similar to the Delta 270, but is $300 or so. The 4ZD1 head from the '88 & '89 EFI Impulse had the larger 2.6 valves & no provisions for a mechanical fuel pump. The 2.6 valves and seats can be installed into any 4ZD1 head. You can also get a compression boost using the late model 2.6 head that were on engines with the pie-shaped dish in the piston top. When fitted to an engine with the round piston top dish it increases the compression much like using a 4ZD1 head and already has the 2.6 valves.


So would I need to use the "swivel foot valve adjusters" for any reground cam? I talked to someone at Delta Cams that said to they could resurface the rocker arms. Would this option eliminate the need for the swivel foot valve adjusters?

Sorry for the thread hijack.
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Postby psguardian » Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:31 pm

I would trust the elephants foot lash adjusters before I let them play with a perfectly good set of rockers. (not that they would mess them up, just faster to swap out the adjustment screws)

--back to topic--

The Calmini has different lobe centers (so no its not a re-grind). It has some timing event changes hard coded into the design (still not sure the exact impact of these differences though).

The stock cam lifts the valve about 0.394" off the seat & is open for approx 170-200* (this may be a difference between 4Zxx motors turbo'd or natural) What this guy does is add material to the lobes & reshape the lobe for different duration & as much lift as he can get without letting the valves 'bounce' shut at the end.

From what I understand... Increasing lift lets air/fuel in FASTER, increasing duration allows the power band to stretch higher up the RPM scale before it runs out of breath, putting the two together means you can have a drag strip car that sux in rush hour traffic, or a really strong mid range performer.

Mike (the canada grinder) said that he would take either of the first two options he was quoted on earlier...

Lift in inches, duration at .050"

440/218 torquer/street power, mildly rough idle
465/224 street/strip type grind, rougher idle

So lift at peek of lobe is 0.440" & duration from 0.050"-to-0.050" its 218*
This is already well past both of deltas offerings in regard to duration and lift. I think we may want to get someone who has a CAM mapping program (i'll be looking for one) and drop our stock cam into it, then start playing. Something with higher lift & shorter duration may be a good answer, I don't know.

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Cam

Postby muddy amigo » Mon Jan 17, 2011 12:08 am

Hey ya'll I have a 94 amigo and I am gettin tired of it not having the power I need it to have. How hard is it to install a cam? I might get the 270 cam that was mentioned earlier here. And while I am doing major engine work I have a clicking valve that I want to take care of. Anyone know where I can get some good valves?
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Re: Cam

Postby psguardian » Mon Jan 17, 2011 12:46 am

muddy amigo wrote:Hey ya'll I have a 94 amigo and I am gettin tired of it not having the power I need it to have. How hard is it to install a cam? I might get the 270 cam that was mentioned earlier here. And while I am doing major engine work I have a clicking valve that I want to take care of. Anyone know where I can get some good valves?
All good questions but I think this conversation should go into a new thread started by you in one of the the drive train forums (keep this thread just about CAMs). Welcome to the Planet!

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Postby psguardian » Mon Jan 17, 2011 2:02 pm

Hey squatch I got a reply from Calmini, I requested install and profile specs. The only thing they gave that you didn't have was the lash.

They went with cold lash:
Int - 0.006" (0.15mm)
Exh - 0.010" (0.25mm)

So you can update your OP with that.

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Postby squatch » Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:55 pm

I have sent an email to 3tech requesting some info and describing what I need in a cam. Let's see what they can come up with.

Right after I posted this I spoke with Scott at Delta cam. We talked about the specs in the table at the top of this thread and he verifyed most are pretty correct except for a couple of minor things. Their measurement of a stock cam is a little different of what is posted above and I will note it. It may be that they had a different stock cam. It's my understanding there are a couple of different flavors of stock cam.

Any way during this discussion we figured that Delta's 272 cam is very close to a Calmini with probably just a little more lift . It should operate in pretty much the same RPM range. I ordered one and hope to have it installed soon. I'll degree it when I install it and let you know how it turns out. With any luck (here's where I shoot my foot) I'll have it installed before the URE trip.
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Postby squatch » Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:57 am

I heard back from 3tech. I told him how my truck was set up and what I wanted to use it for and engine characteristics I was looking for. From the email.

I have excellent 2 possibilities.

.428" lift/ 208 duration

.440" lift/ 218 duration

I think either one of those would do the job, with the latter being
stronger in the midrange, but with all that lift, I don't see a drop
in power even at the lower RPM's.

I would need a core, and it would be $150 on your core, plus shipping,
about $20

I think either one of those would kick. That's a good bit of lift on these engines. I'm going to try the Delta 270 for now and see how that goes. Nice to have options though.
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Re: 2.6 cam specs table!

Postby chadzu » Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:24 pm

I put a '96 rodeo camshaft into a spare #2 casting head I have.
I then used c-clamps to solidly mount the head to my metal fabrication table.
Using a magnetic mount and a 1" dail indicator I made some tests on the camshaft.

All measurements were measured at the vavle.
All degree readings are camshaft degrees, not crank.

Intake, .006 lash .380" lift at valve
intake duration measured from .05" lift to .05" lift, 101 camshaft degrees.

Exhaust, .008 lash .378" lift at vavle
exhaust duration measured from .05" lift to .05" lift, 102 camshaft degrees.

I tried my very best to make it as accurate as possible. I rechecked everything two or three times to make sure of consistency.
I am confident that my lift measurements are within a .001" and the duration to within a degree of camshaft rotation.

So this '96 cam looks like it is around .380" lift and 200*
If nothing else it gives some hard numbers to compare the stock camshaft to the aftermarket options.
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Re: 2.6 cam specs table!

Postby chadzu » Sat Jun 16, 2012 10:18 pm

ok, I pulled the stock 1990 camshaft from my amigo and did the same test. Here is what I found.

.380" lift
95 detrees duration based on .05" lift to .50" lift.

I will call the stock camshaft .380 lift and 180*

tests based on .006 int lash .008 exhaust lash.

So, it seems that the '96 cam does in fact have 5 or 6 degrees more duration, that is camshaft duration, so double it for crankshaft rotation.
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Re: 2.6 cam specs table!

Postby ga trooper » Sun Oct 07, 2012 9:22 pm

Just stumbled on this thread. I used the 260 in my truck with the 4zd head on the 4ze bottom end. Cam runs nice. ended up pulling it out in my evolution of the truck. After swapping the stock cam back in, I would say the 260 ran as advertised. I notice the engine is not quite as strong to 25-2800 but the same to about 5000. Above 4500-5000, it really doesnt make anything more. It is done with both cams. Just revs easier with the stock piece cause the cam timing isnt as retarded as with the 260.

Squatch, did you guys ever get a cam from the guy in Canada? Did anyone ever try the 272 from Delta?

My next major project is going to be removing the small head, and finding a good 4ze1 head and forced induction. I have decided to for sure Turbo the thing, just gotta find the right turbo for my allpication. Definitely going to need cam change then.
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Re: 2.6 cam specs table!

Postby squatch » Fri Oct 19, 2012 12:26 pm

I didn't realize this had been added to. Thanks for the hard numbers on the stock cam. No I didn't get a cam from the guy in Canada. I have a Delta 272 on the bench that I have yet to install. Still running the 260 in the Trooper. Almost 50k on that and the elephants feet now. I've been working on putting the Pickup together as time allows and DD my Trooper so no chance to work on that yet. Hope to have the pickup on the road then over the winter I can catch up on the trooper and install the 272 cam. Hopefully!
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Re: 2.6 cam specs table!

Postby MarkB.NV » Thu Nov 15, 2012 3:32 am

Getting a stock 2.6 cam from Johnnie and then going have Delta regrind it as the 272. Gotta get them Empi elephant feet for a VW too.

My '90 Trooper has about 30k miles on a full rebuild and is running the Calmini header and 2.25 inch exhaust with Magnaflow cat and muffler.

I should probably download the accelerometer app for the Droid phone and do before and after runs.

Should be fun. 8)
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Re: 2.6 cam specs table!

Postby EricJette » Sun Nov 18, 2012 1:02 pm

Squatch,

RE;

Calmini 2.3-2.6 cam
Duration at .050 175 degrees
Start of lobe lift to end of close ?
Lift (I assume at lobe) .241 x1.65 rocker=.39768 (.398) at valve.
Lobe centers 108 degrees
Lash int=.006 ex=.010
These should be '87 2.3 specs anybody have them out of factory manual?

---

From '86 Trooper Isuzu Workshop manual (KB-83);

Intake valve- open @ 21 degrees B.T.D.C., close @ 65 degrees A.B.D.C.

Exhaust valve- open @ 55 degrees B.B.D.C., close @ 20 degrees A.T.D.C.

Valve clearance-
Intake 0.15/0.25 mm (cold/hot)
Exhaust 0.25/0.30 mm (cold/hot)

Valve head diameter;
intake- 42.4 mm
exhaust- 36.0 mm

Ign. Timing - 6 degrees B.T.D.C. (800 rpm Fed.-900rpm Calif.)

Just going by what the book says exactly, it doesn't offer anything more.

(all specs are for 2.3 L engine)
95% mech. restored 2dr. /2 seat / '86 Trooper w/ A/C , New 1mil over-bored 2.3L (2305cc)/ All OEM Johnny5ive-built custom "5zd1", w/ 2.6 valves &"Jerry cam" in the 2.3L head/ custom built 3-core radiator/ Exedy clutch & rebuilt msg-5 tranny/ 30/9.5/15's on snowflakes/superwinch manual hubs/fully rebuilt front end - KYB shocks w/ steering dampener & Calmini torsion bars/ 89RS leaf springs w/90mm shackles/custom wood interior paneling & bedlined flooring w /Calmini tri-Y header w/high-flow cat and muffler on 2.25" stainless pipe.

Desert Trooper;
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=61131

Shaolin school of Isuzu graduation day; "And now little trooper, when you can grab this socket wrench from my hand, it will be time to start your engine."
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EricJette
Almost Joe Isuzu
 
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