CO2 tank Howto

Here are all of the best threads. Alert an admin to nominate a thread

Moderator: Staff

CO2 tank Howto

Postby Tad » Thu May 06, 2004 3:03 pm

Several people commented this past weekend on my CO2 setup, so I thought that I'd post a little information about it.

I have a 20lb CO2 tank.

It lasts me approx 6 months (I don't have an air compressor in my garage, so it's my source of air for tools, airing up, using the nail gun, etc). I know that that is a horrible way to tell you how long it lasts, but it's the truth. According to the chart on Powertank.com I should be able to air up 52 33x12.50 tires from 15 to 30psi, or 90 30x9.50 tires (what many Isuzus come with stock), or run an impact wrench for 11.6 minutes. They claim that is 400 lugnuts. I suspect that is an underestimation. They only claim that I'd get 11.6 minutes out of an air cut off wheel, but I spent 15+ minutes cutting some springs out of a jeep in the junkyard one day, and I didn't start with a full tank.

I have a Cornelius brand beverage regulator, with the 0-160psi output (in reality, I can't seem to make mine go to above about 145). It has a standard 1/4" NPT output, so a normal Lowes quick disconnect will thread right in. These show up on E-Bay for about $45, sometimes new for that price.

They look like this:
Image

I have a 1/4" polyurethane hose from www.beavertools.com - $14 and the part number is BA-1202. DO NOT USE THE CHEAP YELLOW PLASTIC HOSES. They don't flow very well at all, and are a safety hazard with CO2 (more on that later).

I have quick disconnect fittings from Home Depot. I started out with their Orange set (not Yellow, which is a different standard). They now sell a much better design, which doesn't require you to pull back on the outer sleeve to connect a tool. You can easily notice it in the store because the sleeve looks like it is stuck half way. These are wonderful, and Lowes doesn't carry them yet. They are compatible with the Orange (and I'm told Yellow) standard quick-connects, so you can upgrade or mix as you see fit.

I carry an impact wrench with 17mm and 19mm sockets (I actually found a single socket that flips that has 17mm on one end and 19mm on the other end). I also carry an air chuck, tractor trailer sized since it is much easier to hold. When I'm offroading, I carry my 3" cut off wheel. The air ratchet uses a ton of air (co2) and I have yet to find a place where it would fit that I couldn't use my hand held ratchet.

The tank sits on the floor, and is strapped both down and to the side of the truck.

I don't have any great pics of it, but you can see it in the back corner (mostly covered by the air mattress) here:
http://tad.luddite.net/gallery/94TrooperMods/IMG_3926

The technical:
CO2 is stored in a liquid in the tank. 20lbs of liquid CO2. The gas at the top is obviously not liquid, and this is what you are using. As you draw gas out, the pressure in the bottle drops, and more liquid CO2 evaporates. The gas (and liquid) in the tank sits at 800psi. Compare this to a Nitrogen tank at about 2500psi, and 3000-4000 in a scuba tank. (For reference, a scuba tank contains about the same amount of energy as two hand grenades). Because CO2 only releases its energy as the liquid evaporates, the large amount of energy isn't stored in a "bomb" format. It would still be bad to have a tank cook off, and care should be taken around the tank (keep your axe swinging well clear of the tank, and secure the tank very well).

CO2 tanks also have ceramic disk pressure relief valves. These have a ceramic disk that breaks if the pressure in the tank gets too high. The co2 is then vented to outside the tank. One Planetisuzoo member had one of his tanks overfilled. On the way back to his house the ceramic disk burt. This caused a loud hissing noise, and a cloud formed in his truck. He rolled down the window, and put up with the noise until the tank was empty, then turned around and paid a visit to the place where he had it refilled.

Now, for the bad:
Once you are out of CO2, you are out. It costs $14 to fill a tank. CO2 gets cold when it decompresses. Real cold. If it is at all humid my regulator will become covered in ice (it still functions just fine). Your hose will become stiff. If you use a rubber hose, it can become like copper pipe it will get so cold. The cheap yellow plastic hoses can shatter once they are that cold. The poly hoses aren't expensive, and they will stay flexible when cold.

You can't use the tank for terribly long when the outside air temperature is below freezing. The liquid CO2 in the tank has to evaporate in order to be useful. At those temps, the evaporation doesn't happen very fast. We tried to use mine in a junkyard in January, and only got 5-10mins of use out of it until it just wasn't evaporating in the tank anymore.

The tank isn't light. My "20lb" tank weighs 40lbs full. If I get a steel "20lb" tank, it weighs 60lbs full. The "20lb" rating is how much co2 it will hold.

Any questions?

-Tad
Last edited by Tad on Tue Nov 11, 2008 5:39 pm, edited 3 times in total.
User avatar
Tad
Site Admin
 
Posts: 5576
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 9:02 pm
Location: Wandering Around
Has thanked: 121 times
Have thanks: 95 times

Sponsor
 

Postby TroopTad » Thu May 06, 2004 3:34 pm

Tad,

I could run a variation of your setup, except using a scuba tank. They make them in 4500psi versions now. Find the right regulator and you'd last MUCH longer than the CO2 tank (and you'd avoid freezing hoses)

Many years of experience in the paintball world has given me a unique perspective on HPA systems.

You could even use one of the low pressure air compressor systems in conjuntion with a booster to refill the scuba
2000 Vehicross
TroopTad
Loyal P'up
 
Posts: 141
Joined: Sun May 02, 2004 10:11 pm
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 0 time

Postby Tad » Thu May 06, 2004 3:36 pm

I'm not excited about having a 4500psi tank behind me. I looked at that option and decided to skip it and use CO2. This doesn't have a problem with iceing up like a paintball gun, but we did have an issue that one time in the junkyard.

-Tad
User avatar
Tad
Site Admin
 
Posts: 5576
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 9:02 pm
Location: Wandering Around
Has thanked: 121 times
Have thanks: 95 times

Postby TroopTad » Thu May 06, 2004 3:42 pm

Scuba tanks are incredibly durable. I've never seen a scuba catastrophically fail before. I have had a paintball HPA 3000psi tank have its regulator blow off, but never a scuba. I agree though that having 4500psi in your trunk isn't a good idea. I doubt it would rupture, but it'd be close if a dumptruck rear-ended you.

Hydrostatically testing your tanks is paramount to keeping them safe.

tanks are designed to take abuse. A hydro-failed tank will still hold air correctly, but it will not stand up to abuse.

The new fiber wrapped tanks are so robust, I seriously have a hard time believing that anyone could break them except with an AP shell.
2000 Vehicross
TroopTad
Loyal P'up
 
Posts: 141
Joined: Sun May 02, 2004 10:11 pm
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 0 time

Postby Starchild » Fri May 07, 2004 7:39 pm

Thanks for the info Tad. I really like your setup. And it's a heck of a lot cheaper than a compressor. Shouldn't have too much of a freezing problem here in FLA. Did you say that you got the tank and get it filled at a welding supply store?

Thanks

Andre
1994 Trooper - Delightfully close to stock
User avatar
Starchild
Zu Royalty
 
Posts: 1434
Joined: Tue Oct 14, 2003 11:08 pm
Location: Fernandina Beach, FL
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 1 time

Postby Tad » Fri May 07, 2004 7:56 pm

I've only had the tank freeze once, and it was outside, in a junkyard, and it was really cold.

Yes, my local welding store is the cheapest that I've found. It's $12 to exchange a 20lb tank. They don't fill on-site, so they exchange. With the exchange, I never have to worry about having the tank hydro tested. They take care of it for me. I don't always get a "pretty" tank, but I don't care. My Trooper isn't a show vehicle. Most of the time I can get an aluminum tank, but occasionally I end up with a steel one. I always have the choice to not take a steel one.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... eName=WDVW

Something like that would be a good start for someone in my position, but ask your welding and gas stores (we have Arcet and Robet's Oxygen). I asked and it would be $140 for the first full 20lb tank right now from my local welding store.

Having the tank filled is more expensive for me, but that's because a bar supply store is the only place that I've found to do it.

-Tad
User avatar
Tad
Site Admin
 
Posts: 5576
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 9:02 pm
Location: Wandering Around
Has thanked: 121 times
Have thanks: 95 times

Postby bigpoppax2 » Wed Jun 09, 2004 12:05 pm

I'm still waiting on my tank, but I already have my regulator. Found a buy it now for 24 dollars on ebay. I have my coiled hose and all I lack is a fire ext. holder for holding it in place.

My local gas supply shop will fill a 20# CO2 tank for $8.

I will have my setup soon.

I saw Tad's at the last Uwharrie and was very impressed. I had always drooled over on-board air compressor and such. But this is WAY cheaper and very handy to have.

Thanks for the idea.
Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment.

98 RodeoPort 34" LTB's, Supercharged and some other cool stuff.
User avatar
bigpoppax2
Forum Admin
 
Posts: 7208
Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2004 6:15 pm
Location: Morgantown WV
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 14 times

Postby wareagle » Wed Jun 09, 2004 7:44 pm

Joe: What reguklator did you get for $24? Also, let me know if you find a deal on tanks. I'm looking for a setup for uwahrrie too. I'll let you know if I find something local. Last year, you could get nearly new aluminum beverage tanks filled for $60 from local beverage co.
Mark - Knoxville, TN 2000 Land Cruiser
ARB bull bar, Warn M8000, Hella 4000 HIDs w/ city light, IPFs, Snorkel, Ironman t-bars, OME 866 coils, 30mm MAF spacers, OME N100/N101 shocks, 285/75/16s ATs, BIO Diff drop, skids, sliders, rear bumper, and safari rack.
.

SOLD>>>95Trooper,fr LockRight,rr LSD,5sp,TeraLow,Indy tierod& QD sway,CO2, RS9000,OME912&2.5"spacer,1"BL,ARB w/Warn M8000,OBT rear bumper&slider

Trooper and Cruiser pics
User avatar
wareagle
Trail Master
 
Posts: 763
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2003 2:31 pm
Location: Knoxville, TN
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 1 time

Postby bigpoppax2 » Wed Jun 09, 2004 9:07 pm

It's a Cornelius brand it had a buy it now option. I jumped on it. I have friends in low places as far as the tank goes. A buddy I go to church with works at a bottling company and he thinks he can get me one free. We'll see how that works out. I have seen them on ebay for as cheap as 50 bucks just the other day.
Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment.

98 RodeoPort 34" LTB's, Supercharged and some other cool stuff.
User avatar
bigpoppax2
Forum Admin
 
Posts: 7208
Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2004 6:15 pm
Location: Morgantown WV
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 14 times

I think you started something Tad

Postby Starchild » Thu Jun 10, 2004 8:04 am

My bottle and regulator are on the way. My Dad just found me a 20 lb bottle with regulator at a garage sale. I had him looking ever since I realized he has the exact same setup for his homebrew kegs. I just need an air hose and I'm good to go.

Andre
1994 Trooper - Delightfully close to stock
User avatar
Starchild
Zu Royalty
 
Posts: 1434
Joined: Tue Oct 14, 2003 11:08 pm
Location: Fernandina Beach, FL
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 1 time


Postby HCMP » Thu Jun 10, 2004 10:53 am

Any idea what the out-put is with that regulator (CFM)? I know it will depend based on the regulator but was trying to get a ballpark example.

Trying here to figure out what is best for me based on availablity/cost of refills, cost of set-up, availability of space in the amigo, security with a soft top, and out-put.

I've used:
-DougH's CO2 set-up which is fast (don't know the out-put)
-a York compressor, also very fast @ 8CFM

Thinking about an under hood compressor, with no tank to start at least. QuickAir is somewhere around 3-4 CFM.

Thanks, --jeremy
HCMP
Drives in Mud
 
Posts: 82
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 9:22 pm
Location: Ashland, MA
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 0 time

Postby TroopTad » Thu Jun 10, 2004 9:17 pm

I always thought regulators were rated in PSI.
2000 Vehicross
TroopTad
Loyal P'up
 
Posts: 141
Joined: Sun May 02, 2004 10:11 pm
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 0 time

Postby Tad » Fri Jun 11, 2004 8:22 am

Many regulators are rated in PSI. You can get them rated for flow too. Those tend to be used for things like welding where you want "4 cubic feet/hour" instead of "120psi." The issue that comes up with CO2 is that you can get a regulator that will regulate to 120psi, but won't flow well enough to run an air tool. Or they will flow enough to run an air tool for a little while, then ice up enough to restrict the flow.

That's why I recommended Cornelius brand regulators, because I've tested them to have enough flow. Other brands might work just fine, but I can't say for sure. I've examed a few beverage regulators at yard sales, and they definitely don't have passages that are as large as the Cornelius that I have. That may or may not be a problem. The other really nice thing with the Cornelius is that it has a 1/4" NPT fitting, so you can just screw in your quick-disconnect from Lowes.

Skip welding regulators all together. They won't flow enough, and can't be set to a high enough pressure to do you any good.

-Tad
User avatar
Tad
Site Admin
 
Posts: 5576
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 9:02 pm
Location: Wandering Around
Has thanked: 121 times
Have thanks: 95 times

Postby wareagle » Sun Jun 27, 2004 1:26 pm

BTT< OK I now have a hose, regulator, and some misc fittings. all I need is a tank. Anyone got a good source for cheapos?
Mark - Knoxville, TN 2000 Land Cruiser
ARB bull bar, Warn M8000, Hella 4000 HIDs w/ city light, IPFs, Snorkel, Ironman t-bars, OME 866 coils, 30mm MAF spacers, OME N100/N101 shocks, 285/75/16s ATs, BIO Diff drop, skids, sliders, rear bumper, and safari rack.
.

SOLD>>>95Trooper,fr LockRight,rr LSD,5sp,TeraLow,Indy tierod& QD sway,CO2, RS9000,OME912&2.5"spacer,1"BL,ARB w/Warn M8000,OBT rear bumper&slider

Trooper and Cruiser pics
User avatar
wareagle
Trail Master
 
Posts: 763
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2003 2:31 pm
Location: Knoxville, TN
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 1 time

Postby bigpoppax2 » Sun Jun 27, 2004 7:50 pm

I have seen a few on e-bay for about 50 bucks or so.
Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment.

98 RodeoPort 34" LTB's, Supercharged and some other cool stuff.
User avatar
bigpoppax2
Forum Admin
 
Posts: 7208
Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2004 6:15 pm
Location: Morgantown WV
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 14 times

Postby toolow87isupup » Thu Dec 28, 2006 3:16 am

gosh tad now you makin me want to go to class and have me one the Co2 tanks from the welding shop. heck if i ran a tee form the bottle to two regulators i could have all the air tools going and have a flux core welder on board. just need big campin generator.

:roll: aw i want my pup to be a rolling auto shop. just imagine...... "Hillbilly Delux on-site auto repair/ fabrication" slogan:... "If I can't fix it good by the third time, you can have one of my 6 wives." :lol:
87 P'UP 2.3/2BBL 5speed single cab LBD/2WD....added tach, pioneer CD, pioneer 4x6 3way, CB radio w/dual firestix...... since exploding my muffler now have free cherry bomb glass pack. SOLD... :(

91 Isuzu Amigo XS, 2.6l 5spd 4wd, stock for a minute.31x10.50 bfg km. cb radio. delta 260 cam, cherry bomb muffler, k&n airfilter, home port and polish, hella 700FF lights tucked behind the grill.
User avatar
toolow87isupup
Mi Amigo
 
Posts: 161
Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2006 1:04 am
Location: back in o-town, ut
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 0 time

Postby Tad » Thu Dec 28, 2006 9:53 am

toolow87isupup wrote:gosh tad now you makin me want to go to class and have me one the Co2 tanks from the welding shop. heck if i ran a tee form the bottle to two regulators i could have all the air tools going and have a flux core welder on board. just need big campin generator.

:roll: aw i want my pup to be a rolling auto shop. just imagine...... "Hillbilly Delux on-site auto repair/ fabrication" slogan:... "If I can't fix it good by the third time, you can have one of my 6 wives." :lol:


You need one of these:

http://www.premierpowerwelder.com/index2.html

-Tad
User avatar
Tad
Site Admin
 
Posts: 5576
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 9:02 pm
Location: Wandering Around
Has thanked: 121 times
Have thanks: 95 times

Postby toolow87isupup » Fri Dec 29, 2006 2:59 am

by golly gee :shock: me want really bad... no isuzu on the list though.... hmm oh well i guess just pick up the 22re toyota version and custom fab a mount out of 1/4" steel.

your the best tad.
87 P'UP 2.3/2BBL 5speed single cab LBD/2WD....added tach, pioneer CD, pioneer 4x6 3way, CB radio w/dual firestix...... since exploding my muffler now have free cherry bomb glass pack. SOLD... :(

91 Isuzu Amigo XS, 2.6l 5spd 4wd, stock for a minute.31x10.50 bfg km. cb radio. delta 260 cam, cherry bomb muffler, k&n airfilter, home port and polish, hella 700FF lights tucked behind the grill.
User avatar
toolow87isupup
Mi Amigo
 
Posts: 161
Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2006 1:04 am
Location: back in o-town, ut
Has thanked: 0 time
Have thanks: 0 time

Postby Smiley » Tue Nov 11, 2008 9:56 am

BTT

This thread is an extremely valuable source of information!
(I’ve probably read it a-half-dozen-times now)




It took a while, but I presently have three 20# CO2 Bottles sitting in my basement – one of which is a Siphon Tank, suitable for refilling Paintball Bottles (upright/non-inverted)… however, they are all out-of-date and need to be pressure tested.

I did have four such bottles, but back in May, I took one of them to my local welding supply shop to have it pressure tested…… and waited…… and waited…… and waited for the phone to ring. --- Finally, in July, I returned to inquire about the hold-up. --- I was informed that it sometimes takes as long as two months to get a tank back, and that mine should be coming in “any day nowâ€
Last edited by Smiley on Thu Nov 13, 2008 4:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
"I don't know what you're painting that drive shaft for... It's not like anyone's ever gonna see it" ~ Joe Berry (BigPoppa) circa 2004
"Needs more Cow Bell!" :lol:

~ 1999 Isuzu VehiCROSS..... "The VX" ~ 912s | Indy4x HD Tie Rods [>SOLD<]
~ 1998 Acura SLX................ 'The Chariot of the Goddess' ~ bone stock
~ 1998 Isuzu Amigo S......... "Bruiser" ~ MUA5 | 3"+ 3" | 912s | Nitrochargers | 33x12.50s | Lockright [>SOLD<]
~ 1998 Isuzu Rodeo S......... "Old #6" ~ 912s | Bilstein 5100s (f) / Nitrochargers (r) | 32x11.50s | 3.07s | very nicely ARB'd, Indy4x'd, and DOR'd [>SOLD<]
~ 1997 Isuzu Rodeo S......... "THUD" ~ MUA5 | 3"+ 3" | 3.07s | OME HD Leaf Springs | MWM Rock Bars | Yellow 1-pc. Drive Shaft [> SOLD <]
~ 1995 Isuzu Trooper S....... "Heart of Gold" ~ MUA5 | 912s + 1" Spacer | 3.07s | 5.38s | 35x12.50s | ARB Bumper | Snorkel | Infinite Improbability Drive

ALL OF THEM for less than the cost of one brand new SUV.............................. PRICELESS!
User avatar
Smiley
Forum Admin
 
Posts: 3579
Joined: Thu Jul 03, 2003 10:48 am
Location: BFE, WV
Has thanked: 26 times
Have thanks: 5 times

Postby Gizmo42 » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:50 pm

The air hose is easy. Just go to HF. LINKY. I got one for my little air compressor. After having 2 of the cheap yellow plastic hoses break on me many years ago I refuse to ever buy another one. I think the poly hose was about $1 more then the plastic ones at HF.

My co2 tank is on the roof of another bldg at the moment so cant see what regulator is on there. It flows really well though, we use them for blowing out equipment. I'll be using it tomorrow so I can see what kind it is.
--Dave
Image
onetouch wrote:You're doomed Giz.
User avatar
Gizmo42
Subscriber
 
Posts: 11467
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2005 11:15 pm
Location: Aurora, Co.
Has thanked: 11 times
Have thanks: 132 times

Postby Med!c » Sun May 10, 2009 6:30 pm

the only CO2 tank I have is a 32Oz one for paint ball. the first time I ever had one filled the guy over filled it and it the valve released and I was holding it. I was scared as ----, and I got some frost bites. I'm sort of terrified of tanks now, but I need to get one as I need it for welding. MIG welders do such a dirty job without gas.

But I have to say.. Such a great idea tad.
00' Trooper 4x4- V6 3.5L
5-Speed Manual Aisin AR-5
Isuzu 12-Bolt Modified LSD
Isuzu 10-Bolt Aussie Locked
BGF AT T/A KO 285/75/16
Miss my old rodeo.

98-02 Isuzu Workshop Manual: Link
Med!c
I am the Stig
 
Posts: 6256
Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2008 8:19 pm
Location: Maryland
Has thanked: 10 times
Have thanks: 86 times

Postby psguardian » Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:36 pm

Has anyone used a co2 setup like this coupled with a hardline distribution system for external Quick-Disconnects?

I'm thinking of front/rear Q-Ds, so as to avoid leaving doors/windows open during use... Possibly also to power front/rear air-lockers. Do air lockers 'leak' air while engaged, or make an air tight seal within the diff?

~psguardian
hot 2.6L build
Her Rig: '06 TrailBlazer Ext 4.0L Strait 6 (my Daily Driver till my rig is street legal)
Dae wrote:Jerry is the Chuck Norris of Isuzu's, he could build one blind folded with one arm behind his back if he had to. :lol:

PNW Zoo Facebook Group
psguardian
Almost Joe Isuzu
 
Posts: 2701
Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 5:56 pm
Location: Portland, Oregon
Has thanked: 6 times
Have thanks: 26 times

Postby Van » Wed Dec 08, 2010 12:13 am

psguardian wrote:Has anyone used a co2 setup like this coupled with a hardline distribution system for external Quick-Disconnects?

I'm thinking of front/rear Q-Ds, so as to avoid leaving doors/windows open during use... Possibly also to power front/rear air-lockers. Do air lockers 'leak' air while engaged, or make an air tight seal within the diff?

~psguardian


Shouldn't be to hard to do if you use some rigid air lines... routing of the air lines might be a little hassle. Of course some drilling of holes would be required if you run them from in-cab along the frame.

Air lockers will "leak" if engaged for more then a couple of minutes, that's why a compressor will cycle on/off. Of course you won't have that problem with an air tank as long as you have enough pressure.
Van
Donor
Donor
 
Posts: 1809
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2007 3:26 pm
Location: GSP, South Carolina
Has thanked: 22 times
Have thanks: 87 times

Postby Bob w/ a trooper » Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:45 am

Somewhere on here, there's a picture of someone with a quick disconnect under their fuel door next to the gas cap. I always was partial to that setup myself. That coupled with the 25 ft hose that Giz posted up, and you've got a pretty sweet setup.
--
Bob

'91 2.6l manual trooper
Bob w/ a trooper
Rodeo King
 
Posts: 192
Joined: Fri Oct 16, 2009 12:51 am
Location: Houston, TX
Has thanked: 5 times
Have thanks: 1 time

Next

Return to Hall of Fame

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest